NYCPHP Meetup

[Michael Marc-Aurele]

Glad someone responded to Larry's long-winded email telling all how little sense it makes. I couldn't agree more.

-----Original Message-----
From: jobs-bounces at lists.nyphp.org [mailto:jobs-bounces at lists.nyphp.org] On Behalf Of Shahan Avedian
Sent: Thursday, March 05, 2009 11:22 AM
To: Larry Velez; Leam Hall; jobs at lists.nyphp.org
Subject: [nycphp-jobs] Regarding Larry's advice

Bad advice.

1.  "intrigues the person enough to want to have a meeting".... The person who is going to be intrigued is never going to see the resume. The managers at any organization with your skill set are not the people actually seeing the resume first.  Most of time it's the a vendor manager or HR person who has no idea about technology. They scan for buzz words and if all goes well send it off to the manager. If they don't think its right, the resume will be Dead on Arrival.  Furthermore, nobody wants to waste time.  The last thing anyone wants to do is "wonder" if the person is right only to find  out the person is not correct.  The more relevant information on the resume the better

2. the one page resume is fine for someone with no experience, fresh out of college. If you have experience its complete nonsense. In 10 years of recruiting and placing hundreds of IT candidates I have never submitted a one page resume...ever. CEO example given is an extreme exception that most people will never deal with.

3. URLs without question should be in the resume.  You risk alienating the managers who review resumes on a train but the other 99% of people are opening the resume on a computer. Yes, resumes should print well.

4. Most firms have very clear protocols on setting up interviews and talking to prospective candidates.  Managers are not going to violate those protocols. The advice is not only impractical but it risks making you look odd/desperate. You will stand out but not in a positive. There is an excellent chance it can hurt.   IF you actually know someone, you should call. Otherwise nobody is interested in sticking their neck out for an unknown person.

SA


-----Original Message-----
From: jobs-bounces at lists.nyphp.org [mailto:jobs-bounces at lists.nyphp.org] On Behalf Of Larry Velez
Sent: Thursday, March 05, 2009 10:37 AM
To: Leam Hall; jobs at lists.nyphp.org
Subject: Re: [nycphp-jobs] Couple resume questions

Leam,

In my opinion;   I usually throw out any resume that is more than one page,  unless it was given to me by someone I trust and even then - I am usually more critical of a long resume.  If you make me read multiple pages,  you better have run a country at some point.    I think resumes should be just that, a summary that intrigues the person enough to want to have a meeting.   I have been part of a committee hiring a new CEO at a large company and some of the most impressive resumes I have seen were able to summarize roles where they had grown companies from $10-$50MM, with only a few lines.

I don't think URLs should be on a resume,  they can be part of the 'cover email',   if I am on a subway reading through resumes - I can't click on anything.  I find paper is the best way to sort, make notes on and review resumes.   This is why it is important that it prints well.    I personally think all resumes should be in PDF format so they print well.

About what stands out to me,  it is when they have taken time to research the company and can get on a call cold and still recall details about the company and what we are about.  We want someone who has taken the time to understand the company and the sector well before applying and is not just shooting off their resume to everyone.  We want people who want to be here.    Sometimes we will call someone and ask if it is a good time to talk,  it is a great way to filter out many people as you can gauge a lot with a conversation.   We like seeing other activities the person has been involved with,  like if they helped build a house in a village in a far away continent at one point.  Talking about these points in their lives gives you a lot of insight into what motivates them and what they enjoy.

I also find that, for me, you can cut through the email clutter quickly by snail mailing a copy of your resume (in addition to the email copy).  I appreciate someone who takes the time to get this done and if it presents well,  it is a great way to cut through the PDF clutter.  Or just call the company and ask for a few minutes with the person who would be your boss,  ask them questions about the company and the job and about what decisions led to them toward looking for someone for that role.   You would be surprised how helpful people are when you get them on the phone.  If you really really want to work somewhere,  follow up your emailed by dropping off a printed version of your resume in person and ask for a few minutes with your future boss.  It can't hurt.

Just some thoughts.

| Larry Velez | www.sinu.com/believe |

-----Original Message-----
From: jobs-bounces at lists.nyphp.org [mailto:jobs-bounces at lists.nyphp.org] On Behalf Of Leam Hall
Sent: Thursday, March 05, 2009 6:55 AM
To: jobs at lists.nyphp.org
Subject: [nycphp-jobs] Couple resume questions

For those of you reviewing potential candidates, can I get some of your
thoughts on what helps you identify the right person?

Historically I've been told resumes should be 2 pages and no more.
Recruiters want me to expand mine and one sent me a 7 page sample! Mine
would be about 4-5 pages if I used a reasonable amount of white space
and organization. So "What length do you prefer?" is the simple question.

The second one is a bit more open-ended; but is mostly "What formats
help you understand the applicant quickly and clearly?" That is, cover
letter first, skills first, experience first, education, or
accomplishments? Or something totally different?

Probably the more potent question is, "What tells you a candidate is
passionate about helping your situation?" One manager I had shared that
he wanted someone who did the same stuff at home as at work. He had a
good crew and most of us fit that bill. :)

I appreciate your thoughts on this. As a job seeker any help working
through the market troubles helps.

Leam

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